On Sun, May 08, 2005 at 02:41:07AM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > On 2005-05-05 11:26:16 -0400, Derek Martin wrote: > > On Thu, May 05, 2005 at 01:29:05PM +0200, Vincent Lefevre wrote: > > > This is not a problem, as mailboxes created by Mutt (e.g. for > > > postpone or user archives) will normally be read only by Mutt. > > > Even if maildir is the default, Mutt can still work with mbox > > > mailboxes created at system level (incoming mailboxes) for > > > instance. > > > > No, you're missing the point. It IS a problem, if the user (or other > > users reading mail for a group account) don't/can't use mutt for some > > reason, > > If the user doesn't use Mutt, then the default format for Mutt won't > change anything! You cut off part of that... There was a bit about reading mail in a group. As others have pointed out, it is also not so uncommon for users to read mail with more than one MUA. Sometimes I do this, when I have to read my mail from a machine that doesn't have mutt installed... mail(x) doesn't understand maildir. That makes it a bit tough to do, if I have mail in maildir format, n'est pas? > > or if the partition where mutt lives can't be mounted but you still > > need to read mail... I have personally run into such situations in > > the past. > > There may also be problems to use mbox mailboxes, if for some reason > the locking fails. I have personally run into such situations in the > past. :) I don't doubt it... But on modern unix systems, the likelihood of that happening is pretty low. Most vendors have NFS locking fixed, and on local filesystems it just shouldn't be an issue. If you're experiencing mbox corruption today, the problem is probably application-specific bugs, not OS locking problems... [Which isn't to say I think it's a good idea to keep mail on NFS dirs... But locking isn't the only reason for that.] > Also, some messages get corrupted when they are stored in a mbox > mailbox, due to the "From " problem. In fact, this is a sufficient > condition for not using mbox at all. There's no good reason for this to occur. I've been using mbox for years without ever seeing that problem. If you're seeing it, again, your MUA (or possibly MDA or MTA, or the sender's) sucks... it's not an inherent mbox problem. You can not blame the problems of bad software on mbox. As a mailbox format, there isn't anything inherently wrong with it. ALL of the problems related to mbox, present or historical, have been caused by bugs in software, NOT design flaws in the mbox format itself. Maildir may be a little less complicated to program correctly, but that has no bearing on the usability or functionality of the format itself. And it also doesn't mean that a stupid programming mistake couldn't wipe out your maildirs... I like mbox, and for most things, I prefer it to maildir for reasons already stated (mostly performance, and because it's a lot more portable). If it weren't for the fact that mutt doesn't seem to work properly without the ability to make lock files, I'd be using it at work now. I think it should continue to be the default mailbox format, both because I prefer it, and also because I think from a practical standpoint it just plain makes more sense. Your original assertion was: > It [maildir] has often been recommended in this list (or > mutt-users), and never the opposite, due to locking problems. This is in fact false... I have myself recommended mbox over maildir on this list in the past, and I know others have too. I'm not saying it's inherently better than maildir -- both have strengths and weaknesses. I am saying it's better for ME, and for lots of other people who use mail the same way I do. You definitely will see more people recommending a switch to maildir, but that's only because the default is already mbox... There's no need to switch to it, it's what you get unless you expressly do something different. So naturally you don't see as much traffic about it. I'm also not advocating against using maildir, and I'm not trying to invalidate your opinion. Maildir is a good format for different reasons and different purposes, and I'm reasonably certain I've recommended it to others in the past, too. There are plenty of valid reasons for choosing maildir, though I don't think any of the ones you've listed in this message are them. ;-) And I think it should be a choice that's made conciously, NOT the default. For people who don't know better, mbox simply is a better choice. -- Derek D. Martin http://www.pizzashack.org/ GPG Key ID: 0xDFBEAD02 -=-=-=-=- This message is posted from an invalid address. Replying to it will result in undeliverable mail. Sorry for the inconvenience. Thank the spammers.
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