Re: [Mutt] #3040: charset difference between index browser and pager
#3040: charset difference between index browser and pager
Comment (by Derek Martin):
{{{
On Fri, Mar 28, 2008 at 10:14:30AM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> On 2008-03-27 11:21:15 -0400, Derek Martin wrote:
> > On Thu, Mar 27, 2008 at 01:00:29AM +0100, Vincent Lefevre wrote:
> > > On 2008-03-22 16:28:43 +0100, Thomas Roessler wrote:
> > > > The user isn't assumed to run under UTF-8. The user is assumed to
> > > > run in a consistent environment in which the terminal, the file
> > > > system, and local files share a single character set which is
> > > > inferred from the user's locale settings.
> > >
> > > This is absolute non-sense!
> >
> > That statement is stupid, annoying, and inflammatory. What Thomas
> > described is how Unix is designed to work. It's not nonsense.
>
> This is non-sense: download various files from the web, you'll see
> that they have different encodings
There's no dash in nonsense. Let me try a different approach to ge
through to you: Telling a lead developer that he's spouting nonsense
will never, ever get you what you want.
Secondly, I download various files from the internet all the time, in
lots of different encodings, and I NEVER have any problems viewing
them. Why? Because my environment is UTF-8. In the Unix world,
using unicode is THE solution to your problem. You're asking the
developers to re-invent another solution that does the same thing as
the one Unix already provides, that suits your liking, so that you can
stubbornly cling to settings that very obviously don't meet your
needs... when the very simple solution to your problem is at hand:
switch your environment to UTF-8. So who's the idiot?
> > If you're a native French speaker, concerned that someone will send
> > you a mail in EUC-JP and you won't be able to read the characters in
> > it,
>
> With Emacs, I can, even in ISO-8859-1 locales.
You can view Japanese characters in Emacs running in an xterm with
ISO-8859-1 settings and fonts? I sincerely doubt that... Mutt is not
a graphical program, and can not choose what fonts are available on
the terminal it's running in. If the environment is not unicode and
the glyphs aren't available in the fonts loaded in the terminal,
there's not much Mutt can do about that.
> But anyway you missed the point that not being able to read them
> (e.g. in the terminal) is not the main problem. The problem is that
> these characters will be munged by Mutt when contents are
> transmitted to remote users. This is not acceptable.
I didn't miss the point. Switch to UTF-8 and you don't have this
problem. That's the point. There's already a solution to your
problem, and for some reason, you are stubbornly refusing to use it.
Mutt's behavior is perfectly sane; a person who refuses to use a
solution that works well and solves their problem, just because it
does not suit the way they personally think about things, is not.
}}}
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Ticket URL: <http://dev.mutt.org/trac/ticket/3040#comment:>