[IP] on Flag Burning interesting history djf
Begin forwarded message:
From:
Date: June 28, 2006 5:44:09 PM EDT
To: dave@xxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [IP] more on Orrin Hatch/Andrew Tobias on Flag Burning
Dave,
Please render this anonymous. I know personally that Hatch is a
vindictive SoB.
======================
Senator Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) today on NPR was opining that yes
indeed, passing a don't-burn-the-flag constitutional amendment *is*
the most important thing for the U.S. Senate to do right now. In
terms of Rove-Republican strategy this was, like the “anti-Gay
Marriage” amendment, nothing but political grandstanding that was
intended to fail with the intent of tarring those who voted no in
anticipation of the November election.
For Hatch, however, it was more. The senior Mormon senator from Utah
proved himself in New Testament terms to be the most complete
hypocrite: “Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!, because
ye build the tombs of the prophets and garnish the sepulchres of the
righteous, And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we
would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the
prophets.” (Matthew 23:29-30) Consider the following orthodox Mormon
record and perspective on Mormons using the flag for symbolic
protest, and how power-seeking anti-Mormon politicians and veterans’
lobbies used that as a pretext to send troops against the Mormon
people. Hatch’s venom against those who use the flag for political
statements proves, in New Testament terms, that he would have
murdered his own Mormon ancestors.
B. H. Roberts, A Comprehensive History of the [L.D.S.] Church, Volume
Six, p. 159-162
HALF MASTING OF THE FLAG INCIDENT
On the 4th of July, 1885, an unfortunate circumstance occurred in
the half masting of the national flag, at the City Hall by some of
the city's officers, and by other parties at the Salt Lake county
courthouse; also at the Salt Lake Theater, Z. C. M. I. Building,
Deseret News Office, Church Tithing Office, the Gardo House—the
residence at the time of President John Taylor; at the temple, and
the tabernacle. There was of course no intention in any way to
dishonor the flag. Placed at half mast it is an emblem of mourning;
and as the community was then terrorized by a cruel mal-
administration of the law against the Latter-day Saints, as
subsequent reversals and condemnations of the procedure by the
supreme court of the United States and the dismissal of federal
officers by the national administration attest—it was evidently a
time of mourning for the Latter-day Saints in Salt Lake City, who
constituted the majority of her people; and the city officers thought
themselves justified in thus expressing that sorrow. Such the
explanation of the city marshal, Mr. Wm. G. Philips—"half masting of
the flag expressed the feelings of the majority of the citizens."
As soon as the half masting of the flag became known among the
non-"Mormon" part of the citizens great indignation and excitement
arose, and angry crowds gathered at the City Hall and at the Z. C. M.
I. store where for a time riot threatened. A committee of citizens
consisting of United States Marshal Ireland, Major Wilkes,—who was an
ex-confederate soldier—Captain Evans, and C. L. Haines, went to the
City Hall and demanded to know the reason for the flag being at half
mast. Nobody knew except that Marshal Philips had ordered it to be so
placed. The mayor and marshal, being in attendance at a meeting at
the Salt Lake "Mormon" tabernacle, were sent for, and on arriving at
the City Hall the marshal took full responsibility for the half
masting. After consultation had with the committee the flag was taken
down, but later in the day it was raised to the head of the staff by
order of the mayor, Hon. James Sharp. A request by the offended
citizens was sufficient to cause Sheriff Groesbeck, at the county
courthouse, to order the flag raised to full mast. The flag at the
Salt Lake Theater was raised to full mast early in the day, so too
was the flag at Z. C. M. I. At the other places enumerated above it
remained at half mast throughout the day.
When word of the event was brought to the G. A. R. encampment
being held that day in the suburbs of the city, fiery speeches were
made, equally warm resolutions passed demanding that the flag be
raised to full mast. It was claimed that the governor had telephoned
to General McCook for military assistance, but that the general
refused to interfere, judging that there was no necessity for such
action. So the incident closed except for some inconsequential mass
meetings that followed. One held at the Methodist church, at which
Governor Murray spoke; and one held by the general public in the
federal court room.
It was thought that a conflict over the question of half masting
the flag would come up again on the twenty-fourth of July, as that
was Utah's Pioneer Day, and it was the custom to celebrate the day—
would it be done by half masting the flag?
Such representations were made to the press of the east that the
question of "Mormon" loyalty was very generally discussed. From Salt
Lake City appeals were made to members of the G. A. R. to ex-
confederate soldiers, and to men in the mining camps to come to Salt
Lake City on the 24th of July to prevent what was alleged would be an
intended insult to the flag by half masting it on that occasion.
"The ex-confederate soldiers," said the local announcement in the
Salt Lake Tribune of this meeting, "are talking of holding an
indignation meeting here on the 24th inst., to express their views on
the insult offered to the flag on July 4th by the Mormon church in
this city."
"The federal court room has been obtained, the railroads have
agreed to give half-fare rates from Park City, Ogden and the mining
camps, and the hotels such reasonable rates as to make it an object.
The sentiments of the ex-confederates are to be embodied in the form
of resolutions to be sent to the southern states and congressmen,
politicians and newspapers in that section * * * It is a good move,
and for another reason. There is talk on the streets to the effect
that on the 24th—'Pioneer's Day'—the Mormons intend to drape the flag
in mourning and float it at half mast. That would be a good day for
the presence in this city of two or three thousand old soldiers,
federal and confederate. It would probably result in a speedy and
effectual settlement of the whole Mormon business, for with such men
here in force the nation's flag would not be insulted with impunity."
Such representations were made to President Cleveland as to the
prospect of a riot in Salt Lake City that he gave orders on the 17th
of July to General O. O. Howard, in military command of the west, to
station divisions of the army along railroad lines at points from
which they could readily be rushed into Salt Lake City in case they
should be needed. The Lincoln Post G. A. R., Butte, Montana, on the
18th of July, on the strength of reports from General Howard and
"information from comrades of the G. A. R., resident in Salt Lake
City," made tender of service to Governor Murray of two companies "A"
and "B" of that post, numbering "eighty strong," "armed, uniformed
and equipped," and "every man of them a veteran."
THE WHOLE NATION HALF-MASTED THE FLAG ON JULY
24TH, 1885
On the part of the Latter-day Saints the most formidable function
planned for that day in Salt Lake City was the meeting of a mammoth
Sunday School convention in the tabernacle. Things looked ominous;
but strangely enough the United States flag throughout the United
States, as also in Utah, was at half mast that 24th day of July,
1885; for ex-president of the United States, and national hero, U. S.
Grant, at Mt. McGregor, New York, after a lingering illness, died at
8:08 on the morning of the 23rd of July. Everywhere throughout the
nation the flag was placed at half mast; and the threatened crisis in
Utah passed without a conflict.
=======================
And this morning Sen. Orin Hatch was on NPR opining that yes indeed,
passing a don't-burn-the-flag constitutional amendment *is* the most
important thing for the senate to do right now.
David Farber wrote:
Begin forwarded message:
From: Ralph <rs@xxxxxxx>
Date: June 28, 2006 6:46:50 AM EDT
To: Dave Farber <dave@xxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Andrew Tobias on Flag Burning
http://www.andrewtobias.com/newcolumns/060628.html
Flag Burning
Published on June 28, 2006
Oh, for crying out loud.
The whole point of America is that you can burn the flag.
Nothing sums up her greatness so succinctly. And it is precisely
this – that in America you should be free to do any damn thing
you please so long as it does not impinge on the rights of others
– that leads most of us to abhor the idea of burning it in the
first place.
And one thing you should absolutely be free to do in America is
criticize your country and express outrage at its behavior – even
if you’re wrong. We call that the Bill of Rights.
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